1 00:00:00,917 --> 00:00:03,519 welcome everybody to the Industrial Insights Podcast. 2 00:00:03,519 --> 00:00:05,180 I have Doug Sampson with me. 3 00:00:05,520 --> 00:00:08,902 He's with Acme Distribution and IWLA. 4 00:00:09,262 --> 00:00:13,705 And we were just going through the story of Doug's career 5 00:00:14,285 --> 00:00:17,665 and in Acme Distribution. And it's interesting because it mirrors some 6 00:00:17,665 --> 00:00:19,836 of my experience working with a 7 00:00:20,237 --> 00:00:24,985 client that is a family-run logistics business and how that 8 00:00:24,985 --> 00:00:27,006 business evolved over the years. So I love 9 00:00:27,422 --> 00:00:31,145 If you'd continue, Doug, of how the early logistics business 10 00:00:31,566 --> 00:00:36,334 like and real estate like was package business and 11 00:00:36,334 --> 00:00:39,176 that was how people a lot of people like ran that 12 00:00:39,176 --> 00:00:42,674 business at that time and it's exciting because I've seen so 13 00:00:42,674 --> 00:00:46,107 many families end up owning a ton of real estate as 14 00:00:46,107 --> 00:00:48,909 a result, and then when the economy can get out of 15 00:00:48,909 --> 00:00:52,072 whack, that can be stability and like a port in the 16 00:00:52,072 --> 00:00:54,804 storm of not having to deal with landlords and rates and 17 00:00:54,804 --> 00:00:57,972 all of that. So I'm excited that part of your journey 18 00:00:57,972 --> 00:00:59,882 is been seeing that first hand. 19 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:02,661 Sure. So it's my pleasure to be here. 20 00:01:02,661 --> 00:01:04,712 Thank you for having me, Justin. 21 00:01:05,141 --> 00:01:08,503 is as I was talking, I've been in the business about 22 00:01:08,503 --> 00:01:10,173 fifty years. And so 23 00:01:10,709 --> 00:01:15,071 I got into the business as a part-time summer job 24 00:01:15,091 --> 00:01:17,332 unloading boxcars. And 25 00:01:17,753 --> 00:01:21,945 my father was really a commercial real estate guy, more on 26 00:01:21,945 --> 00:01:26,397 the financial side, but I needed to make some pennies to 27 00:01:26,397 --> 00:01:28,588 pay for my way going to college. 28 00:01:29,184 --> 00:01:33,026 And so I didn't know what the difference between a forklift 29 00:01:33,026 --> 00:01:36,070 and a you know a semi was at that time. 30 00:01:36,504 --> 00:01:36,834 Yeah. 31 00:01:37,111 --> 00:01:41,194 I got into the business and started unloading the boxcars and 32 00:01:41,194 --> 00:01:43,596 developing a high curiosity for 33 00:01:44,096 --> 00:01:47,419 why certain cases were designed in certain ways. 34 00:01:47,419 --> 00:01:48,980 And this goes to the packaging. 35 00:01:48,980 --> 00:01:52,163 And I'm talking back in the mid-70s. 36 00:01:52,183 --> 00:01:53,234 So at 37 00:01:53,165 --> 00:01:53,447 Yeah. 38 00:01:53,234 --> 00:01:57,847 that time things were referred to as physical distribution management 39 00:01:57,847 --> 00:01:58,608 typically. 40 00:01:59,144 --> 00:02:03,655 or you know the NCPDM if you will, way back then 41 00:02:03,655 --> 00:02:07,285 before it was CSCMP like it is today. 42 00:02:07,638 --> 00:02:07,955 Yes. 43 00:02:08,065 --> 00:02:10,765 so we got a lot of fancy terms for the same 44 00:02:10,765 --> 00:02:11,365 stuff. 45 00:02:11,989 --> 00:02:14,267 basically so I 46 00:02:14,707 --> 00:02:19,088 proceeded to continue to go back and work every vacation, holiday 47 00:02:19,128 --> 00:02:23,849 opportunity in the warehouse just because I needed the money and 48 00:02:24,595 --> 00:02:28,937 instead of I got these fancy schmancy degrees because 49 00:02:28,957 --> 00:02:33,720 accounting and economics and finance and marketing and 50 00:02:33,886 --> 00:02:38,549 I just had the bug for what was physical distribution 51 00:02:38,549 --> 00:02:43,063 management and fortunately third party logistics, which 52 00:02:43,063 --> 00:02:46,285 means you have a lot of bosses and you're serving a 53 00:02:46,285 --> 00:02:50,467 lot of customers and I had no idea what third party 54 00:02:50,467 --> 00:02:52,248 logistics was back then. 55 00:02:52,737 --> 00:02:53,020 Yeah. 56 00:02:52,782 --> 00:02:56,354 So basically we were warehouses. we were warehouses. 57 00:02:56,354 --> 00:02:57,545 Some people would 58 00:02:58,247 --> 00:03:01,826 refer to us as bonded warehouses, but it gets 59 00:03:01,751 --> 00:03:01,861 I'd 60 00:03:01,826 --> 00:03:01,940 a 61 00:03:01,861 --> 00:03:02,102 heard 62 00:03:01,940 --> 00:03:02,181 lot 63 00:03:02,102 --> 00:03:02,573 public 64 00:03:02,181 --> 00:03:03,372 more complicated 65 00:03:02,573 --> 00:03:03,374 warehouses 66 00:03:03,372 --> 00:03:03,602 is 67 00:03:03,374 --> 00:03:04,737 was another term they would 68 00:03:04,583 --> 00:03:05,603 yeah. 69 00:03:04,737 --> 00:03:05,429 call, yeah. 70 00:03:05,684 --> 00:03:09,257 Public warehouses, yeah, storage and transit. 71 00:03:09,257 --> 00:03:12,063 And the business really developed, honestly, 72 00:03:12,669 --> 00:03:17,203 with the grocery business. So third party or public warehouses, 73 00:03:17,244 --> 00:03:18,204 the whole 74 00:03:18,852 --> 00:03:23,244 origination of them was to act as a storage and transit 75 00:03:23,244 --> 00:03:26,997 and in loading place for boxcars of groceries. 76 00:03:27,737 --> 00:03:32,492 And so that's why you saw those initial bigger box 77 00:03:32,644 --> 00:03:36,617 and when I say bigger box, I'm talking twenty to fifty 78 00:03:36,617 --> 00:03:38,568 thousand square foot kind of 79 00:03:39,168 --> 00:03:43,531 warehouses start to be developed as public 80 00:03:43,531 --> 00:03:45,792 warehouses as opposed to 81 00:03:46,452 --> 00:03:49,074 the private or contract warehouses 82 00:03:49,761 --> 00:03:51,061 and so forth. So 83 00:03:51,601 --> 00:03:54,316 the advent of that concept 84 00:03:54,736 --> 00:03:57,418 was great just with the timing in my life. 85 00:03:57,418 --> 00:03:57,858 So 86 00:03:58,284 --> 00:03:58,567 Yeah. 87 00:03:58,639 --> 00:04:02,102 I started instead of going into business with my dad, 88 00:04:02,643 --> 00:04:06,605 I said I'm gonna stay I like to learn a little 89 00:04:06,605 --> 00:04:09,587 bit more about why staff ships in certain ways, 90 00:04:10,008 --> 00:04:12,090 things communicate and so forth 91 00:04:12,776 --> 00:04:17,000 And the founders of our business were very generous to me 92 00:04:17,435 --> 00:04:19,857 and allowed me to make a lot of mistakes. 93 00:04:20,338 --> 00:04:23,470 And they for some reason they thought I was brighter than 94 00:04:23,470 --> 00:04:26,566 the average bulb and gave me a lot of latitude. 95 00:04:26,927 --> 00:04:27,207 So 96 00:04:27,013 --> 00:04:27,309 Yes. 97 00:04:27,207 --> 00:04:30,435 at a very young age, I was able to play with 98 00:04:30,435 --> 00:04:33,047 clay and say, Why do we do this? 99 00:04:33,047 --> 00:04:37,611 Why don't we do that? And that curiosity still continues even 100 00:04:37,611 --> 00:04:38,642 to today. 101 00:04:39,364 --> 00:04:43,080 It with the business models of where we were growing up 102 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:46,312 back in the mid to late eighties, 103 00:04:46,730 --> 00:04:51,063 the family business, the public warehouse business was 104 00:04:51,063 --> 00:04:52,034 traditionally 105 00:04:52,434 --> 00:04:56,870 a family business and that comprised the operation, the 106 00:04:56,870 --> 00:05:01,178 warehousing, the trucking, there really wasn't a lot of fulfillment back 107 00:05:01,178 --> 00:05:04,700 then, but there was a lot, you know, just warehousing and 108 00:05:04,700 --> 00:05:08,306 most of it moved. as we referred to is in bulk 109 00:05:08,306 --> 00:05:12,277 as opposed to we you know today you know you're taking 110 00:05:12,277 --> 00:05:15,468 things out of cases, out of bags, et cetera. 111 00:05:15,468 --> 00:05:17,649 So it's gotten a lot more complex. 112 00:05:17,909 --> 00:05:21,700 But you had the operational component and you also had the 113 00:05:21,700 --> 00:05:26,131 real estate component. And so we the real estate 114 00:05:26,131 --> 00:05:29,852 component was meant to be a legacy asset that would transfer 115 00:05:29,852 --> 00:05:31,673 beyond all the generations. 116 00:05:32,296 --> 00:05:36,107 de depending upon what you charge the operating company as rents 117 00:05:36,107 --> 00:05:36,547 for. 118 00:05:36,492 --> 00:05:36,828 Oh yeah. 119 00:05:36,887 --> 00:05:40,948 That's really you wanted to make money off the operation, but 120 00:05:41,489 --> 00:05:45,960 it was subsidized by the rents that were being charged as 121 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:47,550 if through the ownership. 122 00:05:48,304 --> 00:05:52,057 and so as our business continued to develop, 123 00:05:52,806 --> 00:05:56,287 we made an acquisition in the late 80s 124 00:05:56,974 --> 00:05:57,344 that 125 00:05:57,768 --> 00:06:01,640 was an another three companies that comprised 126 00:06:02,382 --> 00:06:04,333 at the time we were each about 127 00:06:05,013 --> 00:06:09,615 two and three quarters almost three million square feet so if 128 00:06:09,615 --> 00:06:12,276 you combined a total we were five and a half million 129 00:06:12,276 --> 00:06:13,097 square feet 130 00:06:13,797 --> 00:06:17,138 and we owned every square inch of real estate known to 131 00:06:17,138 --> 00:06:21,480 man and the business itself was centered primarily on 132 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:26,032 CPG type of customers. So if you think about the large 133 00:06:26,608 --> 00:06:29,770 guys that you would see every day now that's in a 134 00:06:29,770 --> 00:06:33,543 Walmart or whatever. That was our customer base. 135 00:06:33,683 --> 00:06:36,565 And it was not untypical to have 136 00:06:37,226 --> 00:06:38,927 one client taking up 137 00:06:39,687 --> 00:06:44,300 four to five hundred thousand square feet of space with 138 00:06:44,300 --> 00:06:46,372 just one customer. 139 00:06:46,872 --> 00:06:47,843 So we had 140 00:06:47,641 --> 00:06:47,844 That's 141 00:06:47,843 --> 00:06:48,133 some 142 00:06:47,844 --> 00:06:48,270 large. 143 00:06:48,133 --> 00:06:52,376 customers as small back then as small as maybe 144 00:06:52,797 --> 00:06:56,966 ten thousand square feet, but most of the clients were of 145 00:06:56,966 --> 00:06:58,307 the larger size 146 00:06:58,893 --> 00:07:00,814 and so there were 147 00:07:01,654 --> 00:07:04,435 compared to today much many less 148 00:07:05,169 --> 00:07:06,709 bosses if you will. 149 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:07,394 Yes. 150 00:07:07,129 --> 00:07:09,578 Well as computers and 151 00:07:10,258 --> 00:07:14,171 started to develop in the late eighties and consultants 152 00:07:14,632 --> 00:07:19,073 and the ability to design supply chains started to come 153 00:07:19,073 --> 00:07:23,124 about. Many of our customers were being approached by these 154 00:07:23,476 --> 00:07:27,757 Consultants saying, hey, we don't know if your warehouses in X 155 00:07:27,757 --> 00:07:31,358 City are the right place. How about you let us do 156 00:07:31,358 --> 00:07:34,359 an analysis for you and we can tell you where the 157 00:07:34,359 --> 00:07:38,230 best place to locate your warehouses at the time were? 158 00:07:38,770 --> 00:07:39,230 Well, 159 00:07:39,631 --> 00:07:42,485 the founder of our business, Jack Grunwald, 160 00:07:43,012 --> 00:07:47,673 he was not real excited about growing outside of 161 00:07:47,953 --> 00:07:49,914 the Denver market at the time. 162 00:07:50,490 --> 00:07:54,980 And so we ended up having the opportunity and declining 163 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:59,672 to set up locations all across the country because the customer 164 00:07:59,672 --> 00:08:01,333 base loved what we did 165 00:08:01,773 --> 00:08:02,013 as 166 00:08:01,775 --> 00:08:02,137 Yes. 167 00:08:02,013 --> 00:08:03,574 a business, wanted 168 00:08:03,125 --> 00:08:03,416 Yep. 169 00:08:03,574 --> 00:08:07,626 us to grow with them and Jack felt uncomfortable about wanting 170 00:08:07,626 --> 00:08:10,917 to make that jump into other cities and locations. 171 00:08:11,517 --> 00:08:12,506 So you 172 00:08:13,036 --> 00:08:13,397 in 173 00:08:13,837 --> 00:08:16,718 Acme world as we continue to progress. 174 00:08:17,119 --> 00:08:21,624 you had customers leaving and as you mentioned earlier, the 175 00:08:21,624 --> 00:08:23,876 real estate is a great asset. 176 00:08:24,316 --> 00:08:27,348 It's a great asset as long as you can release it 177 00:08:27,348 --> 00:08:30,601 on the open market. And back in the late eighties and 178 00:08:30,601 --> 00:08:31,802 early nineties, 179 00:08:32,222 --> 00:08:36,435 primarily in Denver, Colorado, it was like asking somebody if they 180 00:08:36,435 --> 00:08:37,366 wanted cancer. 181 00:08:38,103 --> 00:08:41,476 so the ability to lease that building, we were in a 182 00:08:41,476 --> 00:08:45,648 depression, which is why we built the brine you know, back 183 00:08:45,648 --> 00:08:48,968 then in ninety five built DIA. 184 00:08:49,209 --> 00:08:53,140 But so getting rid of the real estate was very difficult. 185 00:08:53,140 --> 00:08:55,210 We had to do some tough 186 00:08:55,931 --> 00:08:57,679 workouts with the banks 187 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:03,261 and because of the financial side, but we were able to 188 00:09:03,261 --> 00:09:03,811 recover. 189 00:09:04,349 --> 00:09:08,852 And then we started taking a little bit of a 190 00:09:08,852 --> 00:09:13,147 different approach to expanding not only beyond 191 00:09:13,147 --> 00:09:17,849 CPG but also in geography. So 192 00:09:17,070 --> 00:09:17,464 Okay, 193 00:09:17,932 --> 00:09:18,265 yeah. 194 00:09:18,410 --> 00:09:22,873 after the Acme story is then we started expanding all 195 00:09:22,873 --> 00:09:26,275 across the country. We were able to get some of 196 00:09:26,715 --> 00:09:29,597 some additional clients in different verticals. 197 00:09:30,095 --> 00:09:34,587 Acme today operates over four hundred and fifty customers and probably 198 00:09:34,607 --> 00:09:36,407 eighteen different verticals. 199 00:09:36,859 --> 00:09:37,231 Okay. 200 00:09:36,948 --> 00:09:40,449 So you think about you had the CPG as one vertical, 201 00:09:40,689 --> 00:09:44,708 now you know, so your breadth of knowledge has to be 202 00:09:44,788 --> 00:09:48,899 really diverse and also there's a lot of attorneys out there, 203 00:09:48,899 --> 00:09:51,590 so you better be pretty confident in everything. 204 00:09:52,136 --> 00:09:56,567 so we ended up with our initial expansion, we went across 205 00:09:56,567 --> 00:09:57,558 the country, went 206 00:09:58,287 --> 00:09:59,818 with Chicago, Dallas, 207 00:10:00,564 --> 00:10:05,246 Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, Charleston, South Carolina, LA, 208 00:10:05,767 --> 00:10:10,049 and did some national programs and really kind of got on 209 00:10:10,049 --> 00:10:14,110 the map with at that time it was an electronics business. 210 00:10:14,689 --> 00:10:14,961 Okay. 211 00:10:14,791 --> 00:10:16,689 And so we managed 212 00:10:17,549 --> 00:10:22,171 all of the transportation, we managed all the warehousing, 213 00:10:22,431 --> 00:10:26,173 we were managing inventory, we were manufacturing. 214 00:10:26,919 --> 00:10:29,000 for the customer in and 215 00:10:28,911 --> 00:10:29,301 Okay. 216 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,401 of itself. we really expanded just 217 00:10:32,901 --> 00:10:36,304 we kinda we I wouldn't say we were over our skis, 218 00:10:36,625 --> 00:10:40,438 but boy, we were certainly getting bounced around a little bit 219 00:10:40,438 --> 00:10:43,950 by taking those jumps. And I'm really glad that we did. 220 00:10:44,471 --> 00:10:44,791 It 221 00:10:45,303 --> 00:10:49,913 was a great opportunity. is you're aware, third party 222 00:10:49,913 --> 00:10:54,065 logistics people typically don't get very long-term 223 00:10:54,065 --> 00:10:55,116 contracts 224 00:10:55,232 --> 00:10:55,825 Yeah. 225 00:10:55,716 --> 00:10:57,696 with their clients. So 226 00:10:57,256 --> 00:10:57,587 Yep. 227 00:10:57,916 --> 00:11:01,949 to get a 10 or 15 year contract is 228 00:11:02,089 --> 00:11:04,930 extremely unusual as opposed to 229 00:11:05,370 --> 00:11:09,821 most 3PL type contracts are three, five, seven type 230 00:11:09,821 --> 00:11:10,331 years. 231 00:11:10,672 --> 00:11:11,041 Yeah. 232 00:11:10,951 --> 00:11:11,371 And 233 00:11:11,812 --> 00:11:14,957 so the lease negotiation for what you need 234 00:11:15,383 --> 00:11:19,214 and then making sure that your contract, your customer contract, 235 00:11:19,140 --> 00:11:19,490 Yeah. 236 00:11:19,758 --> 00:11:21,488 in your operating agreement 237 00:11:21,889 --> 00:11:25,860 make sure that hey if the bottom falls out you're covered 238 00:11:25,860 --> 00:11:28,510 basically covering your rents and what have you. 239 00:11:28,887 --> 00:11:29,303 Yeah. 240 00:11:29,411 --> 00:11:33,502 so we ended up expanding, doing all sorts of different things. 241 00:11:33,502 --> 00:11:35,392 We started doing fulfillment. 242 00:11:35,936 --> 00:11:38,927 this again is back in the early nineties. 243 00:11:39,487 --> 00:11:43,257 And if to do that we also needed to learn a 244 00:11:43,257 --> 00:11:46,968 lot of things. I mentioned that hey we're manufacturing. 245 00:11:46,968 --> 00:11:47,458 Well 246 00:11:47,898 --> 00:11:48,138 you 247 00:11:48,077 --> 00:11:48,138 Not 248 00:11:48,138 --> 00:11:48,398 know 249 00:11:48,138 --> 00:11:48,622 surprising. 250 00:11:48,826 --> 00:11:51,936 Other than our desire to want to do it, we needed 251 00:11:51,936 --> 00:11:53,930 to get some knowledge. So 252 00:11:54,473 --> 00:11:59,114 there was an association back then called APICS. 253 00:11:59,114 --> 00:12:00,815 And APICS was really this 254 00:12:01,235 --> 00:12:01,615 the 255 00:12:02,352 --> 00:12:06,353 today it's called the Association for Supply Chain Management, supply 256 00:12:06,193 --> 00:12:06,584 Okay. 257 00:12:06,353 --> 00:12:07,904 management, pardon me, but 258 00:12:07,830 --> 00:12:08,091 Yep. 259 00:12:07,904 --> 00:12:12,635 back then they were the American Production and Inventory Control Society. 260 00:12:13,141 --> 00:12:15,642 they would basically give you 261 00:12:16,654 --> 00:12:20,837 education exactly on how you need it to run a 262 00:12:20,837 --> 00:12:25,310 continuous flow production line or just all sorts of things where 263 00:12:25,310 --> 00:12:29,723 we gathered our knowledge, transferred it and put it into place, 264 00:12:30,693 --> 00:12:33,775 and not knowing a thing about, you know, we all became 265 00:12:33,775 --> 00:12:35,236 modified engineers 266 00:12:35,780 --> 00:12:37,231 just because you had to. 267 00:12:37,639 --> 00:12:41,154 and that's the other, you know, it back then third party 268 00:12:41,262 --> 00:12:42,703 logistics people, pardon me. 269 00:12:43,213 --> 00:12:44,554 We wore a lot of hats. 270 00:12:44,734 --> 00:12:47,092 So you know, you're dealing with people. 271 00:12:47,092 --> 00:12:51,468 So, you know, as an owner sh in ownership or plant 272 00:12:51,468 --> 00:12:54,606 management or what have you still have a lot of hats 273 00:12:54,606 --> 00:12:57,659 to wear and we all didn't have just one hat and 274 00:12:57,659 --> 00:12:58,679 do one thing. 275 00:12:59,081 --> 00:12:59,341 Yeah. 276 00:12:59,700 --> 00:13:02,321 the business back in those days was 277 00:13:03,039 --> 00:13:06,609 you know, you worked long hours and did a lot of 278 00:13:06,609 --> 00:13:09,543 different things. so that's really the base. 279 00:13:09,683 --> 00:13:14,246 For how we became Acme. Today we we've since sold 280 00:13:14,246 --> 00:13:15,707 those operations 281 00:13:16,092 --> 00:13:16,428 Okay. 282 00:13:16,268 --> 00:13:20,766 and we operate in a couple other geographies, other than Denver 283 00:13:20,766 --> 00:13:23,178 is Acme's primary location 284 00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:23,889 Yes. 285 00:13:23,639 --> 00:13:26,421 with about two and a half, three million square feet. 286 00:13:26,681 --> 00:13:30,013 And then we operate in the northwest and also in the 287 00:13:30,013 --> 00:13:31,324 northeast. So 288 00:13:32,064 --> 00:13:34,726 with that, it's kind of a nice footprint. 289 00:13:35,631 --> 00:13:39,404 with our existing client base. We've got a couple other things 290 00:13:39,404 --> 00:13:42,627 that are in the works for some other locations right now. 291 00:13:43,064 --> 00:13:43,391 Yeah. 292 00:13:43,168 --> 00:13:43,668 So 293 00:13:44,729 --> 00:13:48,624 and with that I'll kind of jump over into IWLA if 294 00:13:48,624 --> 00:13:50,726 that's okay, because 295 00:13:50,183 --> 00:13:50,915 Yeah, that'd be great. 296 00:13:50,826 --> 00:13:51,396 some of 297 00:13:51,889 --> 00:13:53,801 the education that 298 00:13:54,540 --> 00:13:58,940 we also get, I mentioned the APICS Group or Association 299 00:13:58,940 --> 00:14:00,101 Supply Management. 300 00:14:00,857 --> 00:14:05,551 IWLA has been around since eighteen ninety-one, and 301 00:14:05,632 --> 00:14:06,552 early on 302 00:14:06,978 --> 00:14:09,820 we have always been members, but 303 00:14:10,401 --> 00:14:14,505 really started getting into the crux of what was going on 304 00:14:14,505 --> 00:14:15,625 at IWLA 305 00:14:16,086 --> 00:14:20,790 in terms of the education that they can provide, the advocacy 306 00:14:20,830 --> 00:14:22,272 that they can provide, 307 00:14:23,366 --> 00:14:25,558 and so forth. So probably in the 308 00:14:25,964 --> 00:14:30,077 late eighties, early nineties, we became vi a lot more, myself 309 00:14:30,077 --> 00:14:32,780 personally, a lot more involved in this. 310 00:14:33,245 --> 00:14:36,447 and they have some great educational materials 311 00:14:37,051 --> 00:14:40,764 for anybody in third party logistics from 312 00:14:41,218 --> 00:14:45,801 basically what we call essentials of warehousing, all the way up 313 00:14:45,866 --> 00:14:49,639 pricing, how do you price your goods, you know, your services, 314 00:14:49,639 --> 00:14:52,201 you know, fulfillment is different than this. 315 00:14:52,839 --> 00:14:56,350 And then as you look forward to today's day and age, 316 00:14:56,350 --> 00:14:58,190 with the election being tomorrow, 317 00:14:58,664 --> 00:14:58,962 Yeah. 318 00:14:58,911 --> 00:15:01,062 advocacy and the effect 319 00:15:01,853 --> 00:15:02,173 of 320 00:15:02,673 --> 00:15:05,073 who we put into office has 321 00:15:05,574 --> 00:15:09,355 such huge ramifications for us as an industry. 322 00:15:09,746 --> 00:15:09,997 Yeah. 323 00:15:10,255 --> 00:15:13,286 and when I say us as an industry, I would say 324 00:15:13,286 --> 00:15:17,887 probably sixty percent of third party logistics 325 00:15:17,887 --> 00:15:20,378 companies have their own trucking fleet. 326 00:15:20,858 --> 00:15:21,398 I'm gonna 327 00:15:22,515 --> 00:15:26,638 you know, the fulfillment companies maybe not as much, but 328 00:15:26,878 --> 00:15:31,252 there's all sorts of things from that we look at legislatively. 329 00:15:31,741 --> 00:15:32,039 Yeah. 330 00:15:32,330 --> 00:15:35,683 at a high level, let's go to Washington, you think about 331 00:15:35,683 --> 00:15:36,814 in California, 332 00:15:37,254 --> 00:15:40,016 the OSHA proposed heat standard. 333 00:15:40,303 --> 00:15:40,603 Yes. 334 00:15:40,317 --> 00:15:44,860 So buildings weren't built to be able to contain a temperature, 335 00:15:45,441 --> 00:15:49,735 you know, below eighty degrees when it's in the middle of 336 00:15:49,735 --> 00:15:53,055 summer. go to Dallas, Texas or Baton Rouge. 337 00:15:53,275 --> 00:15:55,077 That doesn't happen. So 338 00:15:55,067 --> 00:15:55,436 Yeah. 339 00:15:55,077 --> 00:15:59,710 being able to modify these buildings to accommodate for 340 00:15:59,710 --> 00:16:03,783 this legislation becomes extremely expensive. 341 00:16:04,132 --> 00:16:04,476 Yeah. 342 00:16:04,363 --> 00:16:08,957 And is there it and more so is there a proper 343 00:16:08,957 --> 00:16:11,428 benefit to the employee? So 344 00:16:11,047 --> 00:16:11,298 Yeah. 345 00:16:11,428 --> 00:16:12,509 and I think there's 346 00:16:12,970 --> 00:16:14,270 a lot of different 347 00:16:14,671 --> 00:16:17,806 opinions on that. And I'll just leave it at that, but 348 00:16:18,060 --> 00:16:19,871 When you have things like an OSHA 349 00:16:20,472 --> 00:16:21,612 standard that 350 00:16:22,393 --> 00:16:25,714 may or may not be applied in certain areas and it's 351 00:16:26,014 --> 00:16:29,396 irregardless of the construction of the facility 352 00:16:29,774 --> 00:16:30,046 Yes. 353 00:16:29,816 --> 00:16:31,337 for example, you know, 354 00:16:31,898 --> 00:16:35,673 sometimes the regulation will go as far as saying you will 355 00:16:35,673 --> 00:16:39,335 have certain conditioning equipment in the building. 356 00:16:39,476 --> 00:16:42,267 Well, it may not need it, but you still may be 357 00:16:42,267 --> 00:16:43,678 required to do that. 358 00:16:44,136 --> 00:16:44,408 Yeah. 359 00:16:44,512 --> 00:16:47,954 probably some of the other things that are affecting us as 360 00:16:47,954 --> 00:16:49,285 an industry are 361 00:16:49,902 --> 00:16:53,883 is as you're very familiar with the South Coast Air Quality 362 00:16:53,883 --> 00:16:54,313 Board. 363 00:16:54,642 --> 00:16:54,945 Yes. 364 00:16:54,873 --> 00:16:59,505 And so the in it's referred to as an indirect source 365 00:16:59,505 --> 00:17:00,387 rule. So 366 00:17:00,110 --> 00:17:00,455 Yes. 367 00:17:01,142 --> 00:17:04,267 the governments have basically said 368 00:17:04,687 --> 00:17:08,929 we believe that trucks are the sole source or not the 369 00:17:08,929 --> 00:17:09,900 sole source but 370 00:17:10,312 --> 00:17:13,705 a major contributing source of our pollution 371 00:17:14,466 --> 00:17:15,426 and we 372 00:17:16,047 --> 00:17:17,028 want to 373 00:17:17,784 --> 00:17:21,287 incent them through punitive and tax 374 00:17:22,039 --> 00:17:22,579 ways 375 00:17:22,276 --> 00:17:22,679 yes. 376 00:17:22,759 --> 00:17:27,123 to basically get rid of the old diesel trucks which are 377 00:17:27,483 --> 00:17:32,227 ninety nine percent cleaner today than they were in nineteen eighty. 378 00:17:32,267 --> 00:17:32,628 That's 379 00:17:32,573 --> 00:17:33,040 Totally. 380 00:17:32,628 --> 00:17:37,082 how much the combustion engine has improved through it 381 00:17:37,633 --> 00:17:40,624 legislation but just other things. But 382 00:17:41,203 --> 00:17:43,045 these indirect source rules are 383 00:17:43,795 --> 00:17:46,497 being applied to folks from Colorado, 384 00:17:47,218 --> 00:17:48,319 New Jersey, 385 00:17:48,734 --> 00:17:53,117 of course California and maybe now the entire state of California 386 00:17:53,424 --> 00:17:53,692 Yeah. 387 00:17:53,478 --> 00:17:56,605 are being applied where by there's an 388 00:17:57,242 --> 00:18:01,841 a way that the business say it's my business I have 389 00:18:01,841 --> 00:18:05,954 to track where the truck came from how many miles it 390 00:18:05,954 --> 00:18:08,406 was and presuming it was a diesel truck 391 00:18:08,846 --> 00:18:10,216 keep track of that. 392 00:18:11,197 --> 00:18:14,417 When product ships, I have to do the same thing for 393 00:18:14,417 --> 00:18:16,358 an outbound truck. 394 00:18:16,979 --> 00:18:21,050 and so there's offsets and the program has points. 395 00:18:21,050 --> 00:18:22,631 They're called WAIRE points. 396 00:18:22,918 --> 00:18:23,224 Yes. 397 00:18:23,231 --> 00:18:26,741 And I'm actively involved in similar 398 00:18:27,481 --> 00:18:32,204 legislation, I should say, that's in Colorado right now, 399 00:18:32,238 --> 00:18:35,380 that's basically a copycat of the 400 00:18:35,874 --> 00:18:37,365 South Coast program. 401 00:18:37,738 --> 00:18:38,034 Yes. 402 00:18:37,746 --> 00:18:37,966 And 403 00:18:38,367 --> 00:18:41,940 those WAIRE points basically say, hey, there's going to be a 404 00:18:41,940 --> 00:18:45,274 certain fee that's going to apply because you're polluting the air, 405 00:18:45,274 --> 00:18:47,602 because you're not using non-emitting 406 00:18:48,103 --> 00:18:51,606 ways of getting those trucks in and out of your facilities. 407 00:18:51,967 --> 00:18:56,461 And there's offsets for certain solar panels on your buildings and 408 00:18:56,461 --> 00:18:57,532 what have you, but 409 00:18:57,933 --> 00:18:58,263 the 410 00:18:59,185 --> 00:19:02,477 it's not the right way, at least in my opinion, it's 411 00:19:02,477 --> 00:19:06,469 not the right way to solve the problem because we can't 412 00:19:06,469 --> 00:19:10,951 electrify. We don't have the infrastructure and the capacity 413 00:19:10,250 --> 00:19:10,556 Totally. 414 00:19:10,951 --> 00:19:12,432 to build enough trucks 415 00:19:12,912 --> 00:19:17,484 in order to actually have the right effect to clean the 416 00:19:17,484 --> 00:19:20,376 air. So what you have is this 417 00:19:21,187 --> 00:19:22,748 substantial tax 418 00:19:23,299 --> 00:19:23,585 Yeah. 419 00:19:23,396 --> 00:19:27,909 Which is equivalent to anywhere from eighty five cents 420 00:19:27,909 --> 00:19:30,561 to a buck ten, a buck twenty 421 00:19:31,041 --> 00:19:33,783 per square foot per year 422 00:19:34,263 --> 00:19:35,804 of additional fee 423 00:19:36,225 --> 00:19:38,626 that is unfortunately passed 424 00:19:39,907 --> 00:19:44,164 along to the client and then the customer, the ultimate 425 00:19:43,689 --> 00:19:44,016 Yeah. 426 00:19:44,164 --> 00:19:47,547 customer, because that's a cost of doing business. 427 00:19:47,547 --> 00:19:52,290 And then as warehouses get analyzed for location. 428 00:19:52,906 --> 00:19:57,587 Those indirect source rules are then also figured into 429 00:19:57,587 --> 00:19:59,428 those costs because 430 00:20:00,008 --> 00:20:04,672 just like Southern California, well, we've seen a pretty large 431 00:20:04,672 --> 00:20:08,723 expansion in Reno, for example. Hey, I don't have to mess 432 00:20:08,723 --> 00:20:11,884 with this, I have the additional transportation cost. 433 00:20:12,545 --> 00:20:16,806 And one early on growing up, we all learned one of 434 00:20:16,806 --> 00:20:21,427 your basic rules was a transportation dollar is typically 435 00:20:21,861 --> 00:20:25,114 seven times more than a warehousing dollar. 436 00:20:25,414 --> 00:20:25,764 So 437 00:20:25,475 --> 00:20:25,779 Yes. 438 00:20:25,764 --> 00:20:29,427 for every dollar you spend inside the four walls, you're gonna 439 00:20:29,427 --> 00:20:32,640 spend seven dollars moving it somewhere. 440 00:20:33,246 --> 00:20:37,780 that's changed, that model has very much changed now, especially with 441 00:20:37,780 --> 00:20:38,650 e-commerce. 442 00:20:39,191 --> 00:20:43,314 And you know e-commerce when I we were just starting was 443 00:20:43,855 --> 00:20:45,296 one or two percent 444 00:20:45,787 --> 00:20:49,770 of our retail economy. And e-commerce today is 445 00:20:50,509 --> 00:20:54,752 going to be about twenty three to twenty-five percent 446 00:20:54,923 --> 00:20:55,291 Oh yeah. 447 00:20:55,332 --> 00:20:59,458 of is in and so is as is a industry we 448 00:20:59,498 --> 00:21:03,571 we've had to change and modify because not only do you 449 00:21:03,571 --> 00:21:08,224 have to fulfill it which gets a lot more complicated inside 450 00:21:08,224 --> 00:21:09,145 the four walls, 451 00:21:09,685 --> 00:21:11,866 but now you have to get it there 452 00:21:12,427 --> 00:21:15,589 and more importantly, you gotta get it there like in an 453 00:21:15,589 --> 00:21:16,030 hour 454 00:21:16,550 --> 00:21:16,800 or 455 00:21:16,706 --> 00:21:17,328 Yeah. 456 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:19,032 at the very most tomorrow morning. 457 00:21:19,312 --> 00:21:20,611 So, you know, is 458 00:21:21,559 --> 00:21:25,712 as a consuming public, you we we've all we like the 459 00:21:25,712 --> 00:21:29,927 convenience. We love the convenience, but it does play 460 00:21:30,312 --> 00:21:34,672 a big proponent in where these warehouses are being located 461 00:21:35,049 --> 00:21:35,359 Yeah. 462 00:21:35,593 --> 00:21:38,334 and what the you know the infrastructure 463 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:41,282 of the delivery system happens to be. 464 00:21:41,704 --> 00:21:45,789 whether it's into a manufacturing facility, e-commerce 465 00:21:45,789 --> 00:21:48,151 supported, whatever. So 466 00:21:48,813 --> 00:21:52,068 but anyway, I'll I've been talking here for a few minutes. 467 00:21:52,068 --> 00:21:52,389 I'll 468 00:21:52,917 --> 00:21:54,498 bounce it back at you and 469 00:21:55,019 --> 00:21:55,720 let you 470 00:21:56,171 --> 00:21:58,433 throw a few more questions or what have you. 471 00:21:58,858 --> 00:22:02,299 Yeah, that was a fantastic primer and you hit a lot 472 00:22:02,299 --> 00:22:05,250 of the important ones. It's always been a little goofy with 473 00:22:05,250 --> 00:22:05,990 the WAIRE 474 00:22:06,766 --> 00:22:10,277 indirect source rule of having that go through landlords and then 475 00:22:10,277 --> 00:22:13,168 to the business. That's always been one that's kind of interesting 476 00:22:13,168 --> 00:22:13,728 that like 477 00:22:14,308 --> 00:22:17,639 if the business forgets to file it, like the landlord gets 478 00:22:17,639 --> 00:22:20,760 a notice and the landlord's gotta tell their tenant and then 479 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:22,330 the tenant's gotta take care of it. 480 00:22:22,511 --> 00:22:23,691 I always thought that was 481 00:22:24,305 --> 00:22:27,117 little bit backwards, you'd think it would just be connected to 482 00:22:27,117 --> 00:22:28,568 the business itself 483 00:22:29,069 --> 00:22:31,511 and then the fact that it's also tied to the size 484 00:22:31,511 --> 00:22:34,543 of the building. So if you're in a ninety nine thousand 485 00:22:34,543 --> 00:22:37,646 square foot building versus a hundred and one thousand square foot 486 00:22:37,646 --> 00:22:39,698 building, you are or aren't 487 00:22:40,712 --> 00:22:44,503 participating in that rule. So it is interesting to think of 488 00:22:44,523 --> 00:22:44,843 is 489 00:22:45,304 --> 00:22:48,947 i that in any way helping solve the problem or is 490 00:22:48,947 --> 00:22:51,669 that just another method of like a taxation 491 00:22:52,518 --> 00:22:54,679 to some extent. But I'd be curious. 492 00:22:54,842 --> 00:22:59,273 you go to Washington, you deal with Washington in some legislation. 493 00:22:59,350 --> 00:23:03,021 That's a lens I would think few people have that experience. 494 00:23:03,021 --> 00:23:06,592 Maybe that's good, maybe that's bad, but I was curious to 495 00:23:06,873 --> 00:23:09,114 understand what that's like, because that's 496 00:23:09,807 --> 00:23:13,039 gives you some good visibility connecting with people that try 497 00:23:12,671 --> 00:23:13,004 Yeah. 498 00:23:13,039 --> 00:23:13,199 to 499 00:23:13,189 --> 00:23:13,552 Okay. 500 00:23:13,199 --> 00:23:15,913 deal with that and see what your experience has been. 501 00:23:16,647 --> 00:23:19,298 Yes, I I'm very lucky that 502 00:23:19,721 --> 00:23:23,322 I think I'm lucky to be able to get the opportunity 503 00:23:23,322 --> 00:23:24,102 both to 504 00:23:24,833 --> 00:23:28,375 lobby for our industry at the state level. 505 00:23:28,903 --> 00:23:32,749 so I'm a past chairman of our ATA state affiliate and 506 00:23:32,749 --> 00:23:34,379 I still go down to the state 507 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:39,332 and testify on proposed rules, regulations and what have you, as 508 00:23:39,332 --> 00:23:42,453 well as meet with regulators at the state level. 509 00:23:43,168 --> 00:23:46,791 one of the huge attributes of IWLA 510 00:23:47,371 --> 00:23:50,534 is its ability to access 511 00:23:51,215 --> 00:23:52,656 Congress, Senate, 512 00:23:53,425 --> 00:23:54,186 OSHA, 513 00:23:54,923 --> 00:23:59,677 National Labor Relations Board, because of all these rulings that 514 00:23:59,677 --> 00:24:04,382 are coming down that are affecting our industry, most of 515 00:24:04,382 --> 00:24:06,994 the regulators don't really understand. 516 00:24:07,546 --> 00:24:11,668 the third party logistics industry were grouped together with 517 00:24:11,668 --> 00:24:13,108 Amazon. And 518 00:24:13,027 --> 00:24:13,343 Yes. 519 00:24:13,789 --> 00:24:15,872 there's I'll give an example. 520 00:24:16,272 --> 00:24:19,293 OSHA has this national standard 521 00:24:20,029 --> 00:24:24,730 that is really piloted against warehouses in general. 522 00:24:25,111 --> 00:24:25,341 And 523 00:24:25,330 --> 00:24:25,614 Okay. 524 00:24:25,341 --> 00:24:29,222 it was really meant as a way to react to some 525 00:24:29,222 --> 00:24:32,754 of the incidents that were being reported in Amazon 526 00:24:33,114 --> 00:24:35,595 warehouses, but they're affecting 527 00:24:36,131 --> 00:24:40,775 everybody because unfortunately there's only one NAICS 528 00:24:40,775 --> 00:24:41,275 code 529 00:24:41,776 --> 00:24:42,897 for warehousing 530 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:42,635 Yes. 531 00:24:43,137 --> 00:24:43,457 and 532 00:24:43,210 --> 00:24:43,493 Yep. 533 00:24:43,458 --> 00:24:46,570 we've tried to one of the things that we've tried to 534 00:24:46,570 --> 00:24:47,441 do is say 535 00:24:48,170 --> 00:24:51,843 there's a difference between what we do as a third party 536 00:24:51,843 --> 00:24:55,656 logistics industry than I think what you're targeting at. 537 00:24:55,656 --> 00:24:55,936 And 538 00:24:55,942 --> 00:24:56,202 Yeah. 539 00:24:56,217 --> 00:25:00,290 we'd like to propose getting a an identifier that says hey 540 00:25:00,316 --> 00:25:04,778 this is a third party logistics business they're contracting, you know, 541 00:25:04,778 --> 00:25:07,701 their services for other companies, blah. 542 00:25:07,967 --> 00:25:08,294 Yeah. 543 00:25:08,432 --> 00:25:09,182 we weren't 544 00:25:09,785 --> 00:25:12,816 fortunate to prevail in that particular 545 00:25:13,356 --> 00:25:14,717 situation, but 546 00:25:15,657 --> 00:25:17,297 I do go to Washington. 547 00:25:18,013 --> 00:25:22,394 I'm in Washington quite a bit just because I also sit 548 00:25:22,534 --> 00:25:25,603 on a board of the Surface Transportation Board. 549 00:25:25,603 --> 00:25:29,174 It's called the Rail Shipper Transportation Advisory Board. 550 00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:30,055 Okay. 551 00:25:29,910 --> 00:25:34,054 And we advise the STB board members, and this is 552 00:25:34,054 --> 00:25:36,035 primarily for rail 553 00:25:36,772 --> 00:25:41,446 if rail freight and related issues that have to do 554 00:25:41,446 --> 00:25:42,837 with service 555 00:25:43,237 --> 00:25:47,260 pricing. You've probably heard about the proposed merger 556 00:25:47,501 --> 00:25:50,588 between the Union Pacific and the NS of 557 00:25:50,514 --> 00:25:50,830 Yes. 558 00:25:50,588 --> 00:25:52,369 which I'm not allowed to say a word on. 559 00:25:53,078 --> 00:25:57,385 so but it is out there, everybody's got their opinions, but 560 00:25:57,826 --> 00:26:01,809 I'm not only does that board meets quarterly, 561 00:26:02,570 --> 00:26:05,012 but then IWLA I'll back up and 562 00:26:05,472 --> 00:26:09,856 IWLA does a fly in where we try to get 563 00:26:10,277 --> 00:26:14,400 many of our members to have the experience to go see 564 00:26:14,761 --> 00:26:16,362 your congressperson, 565 00:26:16,548 --> 00:26:17,005 Yeah. 566 00:26:16,702 --> 00:26:18,594 to go see your senator. 567 00:26:19,128 --> 00:26:22,610 and we have a very strong for us 568 00:26:23,170 --> 00:26:26,582 as big of an association as we are, we say we 569 00:26:26,582 --> 00:26:31,215 fight well above our weight because we get meetings with folks 570 00:26:31,215 --> 00:26:35,787 that many other associations just aren't successful about doing. 571 00:26:35,787 --> 00:26:40,398 We got a very good partner in government affairs that 572 00:26:40,398 --> 00:26:41,488 we utilize 573 00:26:42,194 --> 00:26:45,586 and they have a way to get us a meeting. 574 00:26:45,586 --> 00:26:49,864 So your meeting face to face with your congressman. 575 00:26:50,309 --> 00:26:54,750 your we set up rooms yeah out in Washington 576 00:26:55,111 --> 00:26:58,553 and typically we stay there a couple of days 577 00:26:59,371 --> 00:26:59,591 Love 578 00:26:59,413 --> 00:26:59,633 and 579 00:26:59,591 --> 00:26:59,728 it. 580 00:26:59,633 --> 00:27:01,794 do as many visits as we can 581 00:27:02,215 --> 00:27:05,687 and we try to figure out what the right subjects for 582 00:27:05,687 --> 00:27:10,150 the right people were visiting. So for example, when 583 00:27:10,676 --> 00:27:15,017 we visited OSHA, we wanted to understand more about some of 584 00:27:15,017 --> 00:27:19,308 the new OSHA rulings. Again, the warehouse emphasis program, 585 00:27:19,548 --> 00:27:21,289 that how does this work? And 586 00:27:21,896 --> 00:27:26,064 we had a meeting with the deputy director of OSHA 587 00:27:26,765 --> 00:27:30,724 and we made miles of progress 588 00:27:31,141 --> 00:27:31,507 Love it. 589 00:27:31,804 --> 00:27:35,555 in for him, educating him on where we were coming from. 590 00:27:35,555 --> 00:27:38,386 And we were so far off his radar 591 00:27:39,004 --> 00:27:41,321 that it was really it was great. 592 00:27:41,641 --> 00:27:45,719 And so we have actively engaged as 593 00:27:45,719 --> 00:27:48,631 IWLA to involve OSHA 594 00:27:49,297 --> 00:27:53,220 in making sure that hey these communications, these 595 00:27:53,867 --> 00:27:57,950 these concerns from an OSHA governmental perspective 596 00:27:58,477 --> 00:28:03,069 are shared with us because we're really an association of members, 597 00:28:03,069 --> 00:28:07,094 there's of warehouses, there's 450 members 598 00:28:07,921 --> 00:28:12,025 of public warehouse companies or third party logistics companies. 599 00:28:12,425 --> 00:28:16,608 So there's not that many of us as an association, 600 00:28:16,889 --> 00:28:20,612 but they love having the intimacy to deal with 601 00:28:21,052 --> 00:28:24,445 executive operational management to say, well, 602 00:28:24,282 --> 00:28:24,610 Yes. 603 00:28:24,445 --> 00:28:26,156 this is what we're seeing 604 00:28:26,729 --> 00:28:31,022 in here. Or you they'll set up meetings with regional 605 00:28:31,022 --> 00:28:33,104 directors for you. So 606 00:28:33,076 --> 00:28:33,383 Okay. 607 00:28:33,104 --> 00:28:34,325 if you do have 608 00:28:34,797 --> 00:28:35,967 Some questions, 609 00:28:36,401 --> 00:28:40,758 you rather than just have an incident or an event and 610 00:28:40,798 --> 00:28:45,459 an audit and have everything in a pejorative standpoint, you're more 611 00:28:45,459 --> 00:28:49,503 proactively saying, okay, if we do this and this, how does 612 00:28:49,503 --> 00:28:53,154 that make sure? Do you have any concerns over this? 613 00:28:53,207 --> 00:28:56,525 Are we doing the right things to protect ourselves and our 614 00:28:56,525 --> 00:28:57,225 employees? 615 00:28:57,963 --> 00:29:00,094 And i are we all happy or 616 00:29:00,230 --> 00:29:00,590 Yeah. 617 00:29:00,394 --> 00:29:02,084 what else needs to be done here? 618 00:29:02,304 --> 00:29:05,328 So that proactive communication has been 619 00:29:06,058 --> 00:29:10,029 it's been music to our ears, especially this last year. 620 00:29:10,100 --> 00:29:12,761 our next fly in is in February 621 00:29:13,281 --> 00:29:17,421 and it although we do stay in touch with many of 622 00:29:17,421 --> 00:29:18,661 those same folks 623 00:29:19,101 --> 00:29:22,842 day in and day out. I mean, there there's certain concerns 624 00:29:22,842 --> 00:29:26,638 that hey if some If there's something that's come up, 625 00:29:27,356 --> 00:29:29,477 will we have an active 626 00:29:29,897 --> 00:29:34,528 group that will send notes out to each of our legislators 627 00:29:34,768 --> 00:29:37,609 respective, depending upon where you reside. 628 00:29:38,169 --> 00:29:41,760 and then you know you can state your hey that we're 629 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:45,991 for this or against this because of X or because of 630 00:29:46,131 --> 00:29:46,452 Y. 631 00:29:46,952 --> 00:29:50,548 And so the association has gotten really good. 632 00:29:51,026 --> 00:29:53,791 about advocating for the industry. 633 00:29:54,696 --> 00:29:58,208 W the power of advocacy, how cool is that to make 634 00:29:58,208 --> 00:29:58,929 a difference 635 00:29:59,349 --> 00:29:59,959 and to get 636 00:29:59,772 --> 00:30:00,097 Okay. 637 00:29:59,959 --> 00:30:04,279 on the radar and to have a two way conversation and 638 00:30:04,279 --> 00:30:06,753 when you think of the alternative 639 00:30:07,273 --> 00:30:09,166 of if you didn't have that 640 00:30:08,896 --> 00:30:09,182 Yeah. 641 00:30:09,287 --> 00:30:12,759 to feel like you weren't making an impact or that you 642 00:30:12,759 --> 00:30:15,840 didn't have an active seat at the table trying to figure 643 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,632 out what the regulation might be or what the rules of 644 00:30:18,632 --> 00:30:20,413 the road would be for your own industry. 645 00:30:21,166 --> 00:30:25,187 Yeah. I would go on just from an IWLA perspective. 646 00:30:25,187 --> 00:30:28,469 One of the things when I first started getting involved, I 647 00:30:28,469 --> 00:30:28,779 took 648 00:30:29,322 --> 00:30:33,715 a liking to the legal side, the legal and insurance side 649 00:30:33,715 --> 00:30:34,736 of our business. 650 00:30:35,439 --> 00:30:40,180 and so there's still many companies that have operating 651 00:30:40,180 --> 00:30:42,862 agreements that are either 652 00:30:43,311 --> 00:30:47,943 that they just don't apply, that's old regulations, 653 00:30:47,943 --> 00:30:52,034 there's old and one of the things that the association does 654 00:30:52,034 --> 00:30:54,185 is it constantly updates, 655 00:30:54,771 --> 00:30:58,412 and I I'm fortunate to sit on the committee that updates 656 00:30:58,412 --> 00:31:02,772 its contracts so that we as a group can 657 00:31:02,894 --> 00:31:06,294 make sure that we're protecting our assets 658 00:31:06,844 --> 00:31:07,159 Okay. 659 00:31:07,735 --> 00:31:11,188 in tune the best that we can and you can 660 00:31:12,088 --> 00:31:14,639 probably translate that into the number of 661 00:31:15,203 --> 00:31:19,574 lawsuits and so forth, we've recently out your way, there's been 662 00:31:19,574 --> 00:31:23,314 a couple pretty major warehouse fires, for example. 663 00:31:23,096 --> 00:31:24,462 Yes, there have been. 664 00:31:24,716 --> 00:31:29,200 so you know oh and so you can think about the 665 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:30,430 number of suits 666 00:31:31,186 --> 00:31:35,107 and the number of attorneys and so the although 667 00:31:35,652 --> 00:31:39,933 there's still way too many attorneys to protect every contract 668 00:31:40,350 --> 00:31:40,737 Yes. 669 00:31:40,894 --> 00:31:41,464 to the 670 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:43,741 the degree you want it, 671 00:31:44,262 --> 00:31:45,702 the ability for 672 00:31:46,503 --> 00:31:50,325 you to have a very solid stance knowing the industry 673 00:31:50,766 --> 00:31:53,667 is promoting a certain set 674 00:31:54,116 --> 00:31:58,913 of perform you know, criteria that says, hey, if then this 675 00:31:58,962 --> 00:32:00,503 and in and typically 676 00:32:01,123 --> 00:32:05,566 most people don't think about something again in third 677 00:32:05,566 --> 00:32:07,176 party logistics if you 678 00:32:07,614 --> 00:32:11,687 lost it or broke it, well there's a claim situation for 679 00:32:11,687 --> 00:32:13,269 whatever it happened to be. 680 00:32:13,662 --> 00:32:13,962 Yes. 681 00:32:14,330 --> 00:32:15,170 and so 682 00:32:15,591 --> 00:32:19,787 these contracts, if they're properly written, spell out what the 683 00:32:19,787 --> 00:32:21,479 desired outcome will be. 684 00:32:22,101 --> 00:32:25,074 and there's ranges again, there's 685 00:32:25,492 --> 00:32:27,433 there's lots of openness 686 00:32:27,868 --> 00:32:29,709 for ways to resolve that. 687 00:32:30,110 --> 00:32:33,112 The most important point is that you address it 688 00:32:33,561 --> 00:32:36,754 in the contractual relationship with your client, 689 00:32:37,308 --> 00:32:41,180 so that it's it had it, you know, again, what if 690 00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:45,315 something's not defined, it gets really difficult, whether through 691 00:32:45,315 --> 00:32:46,966 arbitration or case, 692 00:32:47,454 --> 00:32:50,396 if now all of a sudden the monetary value 693 00:32:50,876 --> 00:32:55,299 and or a potential punitive or consequential damage 694 00:32:55,679 --> 00:32:59,300 can be added into a specific situation. 695 00:32:59,300 --> 00:32:59,740 So 696 00:33:00,569 --> 00:33:04,321 Sorry to digress into one of the other IWLA attributes. 697 00:33:04,682 --> 00:33:08,284 Yeah, I love it. In our world we have AIR lease 698 00:33:08,284 --> 00:33:12,966 contracts and they're the boilerplate that most private parties use 699 00:33:13,126 --> 00:33:17,008 of and like we're talking from a million to ten million 700 00:33:17,008 --> 00:33:19,789 to a hundred million like a size of deals. 701 00:33:20,310 --> 00:33:24,973 And then you have the institutional grade contracts that are drafted 702 00:33:24,973 --> 00:33:26,293 by big law firms 703 00:33:26,814 --> 00:33:31,555 and it's always interesting to think of the AIR boilerplate saves 704 00:33:31,555 --> 00:33:35,036 everybody so much time, so much money, everybody's so familiar with 705 00:33:35,067 --> 00:33:38,549 It may it's a balanced contract and it's something that has 706 00:33:38,549 --> 00:33:41,761 proliferated through the industry so that it's not for all deals 707 00:33:41,761 --> 00:33:45,242 at all times, but it probably covers ninety percent of all 708 00:33:45,678 --> 00:33:49,281 private party transactions and it's just a way that like everyone 709 00:33:49,281 --> 00:33:50,823 has become so familiar with it. 710 00:33:50,823 --> 00:33:53,425 You would sign it as a landlord, you would sign it 711 00:33:53,425 --> 00:33:56,037 as a tenant, you would feel very comfortable with it, and 712 00:33:56,037 --> 00:33:58,369 then it saves so much time, so much money, so much 713 00:33:58,369 --> 00:34:01,811 effort, and just like is has an ability to speed up 714 00:34:01,892 --> 00:34:05,586 and like grease the wheels of commerce while still like protecting 715 00:34:05,586 --> 00:34:06,677 everybody and it's 716 00:34:07,267 --> 00:34:10,931 updated regularly, but we're talking like once every five years or 717 00:34:10,931 --> 00:34:14,111 something that's far enough where You're not always worried about which 718 00:34:14,111 --> 00:34:16,743 version you have and you always feel pretty good and you 719 00:34:16,743 --> 00:34:18,954 can customize the hell out of it if you really need 720 00:34:18,954 --> 00:34:20,646 to or want to. But 721 00:34:21,053 --> 00:34:23,895 that's reminds me of that just 'cause that's an example we 722 00:34:23,895 --> 00:34:26,117 have in our industry that we're all very thankful for and 723 00:34:26,182 --> 00:34:29,339 it like helps create a lot of opportunity that might have 724 00:34:29,339 --> 00:34:30,630 gotten gummed up in 725 00:34:31,492 --> 00:34:33,964 red line comments and back and forth and kinda just like 726 00:34:33,964 --> 00:34:34,704 expensive 727 00:34:35,294 --> 00:34:38,566 legal fees that sometimes are necessary and then sometimes are not 728 00:34:38,566 --> 00:34:39,587 necessary for sure. 729 00:34:40,118 --> 00:34:43,260 it makes me laugh just 'cause as I you know, early 730 00:34:43,260 --> 00:34:46,182 in my career I think some of our lease agreements were 731 00:34:46,182 --> 00:34:47,463 five, seven pages. 732 00:34:47,860 --> 00:34:48,223 Yes. 733 00:34:48,772 --> 00:34:49,093 Oh. 734 00:34:48,984 --> 00:34:49,435 Maybe 735 00:34:49,197 --> 00:34:49,822 Totally. 736 00:34:49,435 --> 00:34:54,203 compare that to your agreements. but again, the it's necessary 737 00:34:54,266 --> 00:34:58,401 which is also why you need to be engaged in your 738 00:34:58,461 --> 00:35:03,254 government advocacy, whether it's an ordinance, a tax, 739 00:35:03,254 --> 00:35:03,685 a fee, 740 00:35:04,117 --> 00:35:07,998 you know, a state regulation, a federal regulation, or what have 741 00:35:07,998 --> 00:35:08,278 you, 742 00:35:08,778 --> 00:35:11,299 all of that trickles down into 743 00:35:11,699 --> 00:35:16,340 what's gonna happen should this occur in your lease 744 00:35:16,340 --> 00:35:20,709 agreement, your operating agreement, whatever. And if you don't know. 745 00:35:20,834 --> 00:35:23,195 I love that saying, hey, we just don't know what we 746 00:35:23,195 --> 00:35:26,136 don't know. Well you need to be proactive 747 00:35:26,666 --> 00:35:29,627 if you're gonna be in the business at any level. 748 00:35:30,789 --> 00:35:34,061 You owe it to yourselves and your employees to make sure 749 00:35:34,061 --> 00:35:38,413 that you're doing your best due diligence to make sure 750 00:35:38,413 --> 00:35:43,125 does this is this something that concerns our business? 751 00:35:43,266 --> 00:35:46,676 And if so, what are we gonna do about it and 752 00:35:46,676 --> 00:35:50,149 how is it negotiated through the transaction? 753 00:35:51,370 --> 00:35:52,845 So yeah, it's 754 00:35:53,422 --> 00:35:57,071 Yeah, that's so true. And then once you know then you'll 755 00:35:57,071 --> 00:35:59,985 never forget it, 'cause it left a big mark on you. 756 00:36:00,389 --> 00:36:00,789 That's 757 00:36:01,610 --> 00:36:05,152 that yeah, it typically only takes one, that's for sure. 758 00:36:05,662 --> 00:36:06,119 Yeah. 759 00:36:06,152 --> 00:36:09,265 it it's funny, I will go back to the indirect source 760 00:36:09,265 --> 00:36:13,137 thing for a quick moment. in Colorado, the proposed you were 761 00:36:13,137 --> 00:36:17,219 talking about a hundred thousand square feet being the cutoff of 762 00:36:17,219 --> 00:36:19,140 the existing model. 763 00:36:19,583 --> 00:36:20,473 the proposed 764 00:36:21,186 --> 00:36:25,068 regulation out in Colorado is ten thousand square feet. 765 00:36:25,348 --> 00:36:25,908 So 766 00:36:25,502 --> 00:36:25,954 Okay. 767 00:36:25,929 --> 00:36:26,279 think 768 00:36:26,177 --> 00:36:26,518 That's 769 00:36:26,279 --> 00:36:26,679 about 770 00:36:26,518 --> 00:36:27,413 pretty much everybody. 771 00:36:27,103 --> 00:36:27,853 incumb 772 00:36:28,569 --> 00:36:33,097 that's pretty much everybody and it think about sports venues 773 00:36:33,578 --> 00:36:36,339 so it includes sports venues the airport 774 00:36:36,925 --> 00:36:40,767 it it's gonna be a heck of an encumbrance for all 775 00:36:40,767 --> 00:36:45,039 these companies that don't have the resources anyway to 776 00:36:44,866 --> 00:36:45,248 Yeah. 777 00:36:45,039 --> 00:36:46,270 be able to track 778 00:36:46,750 --> 00:36:50,952 all of this activity that they're in addition to everything else 779 00:36:50,952 --> 00:36:52,133 they're doing. So 780 00:36:52,525 --> 00:36:52,821 Yeah. 781 00:36:53,114 --> 00:36:53,694 in and 782 00:36:54,128 --> 00:36:58,621 we're trying to get some latitude in modifying 783 00:36:58,701 --> 00:37:03,313 that, but we have not yet been successful to try and 784 00:37:03,313 --> 00:37:06,205 at least get it back up to where South Coast is. 785 00:37:06,649 --> 00:37:08,351 Yeah, employees with at 786 00:37:08,266 --> 00:37:08,476 it 787 00:37:08,351 --> 00:37:11,806 least a hundred employees or fifty employees or at least doing 788 00:37:11,806 --> 00:37:15,382 ten million or hundred million or other ways of measuring it 789 00:37:15,382 --> 00:37:17,515 that can make sure it's not like 790 00:37:18,112 --> 00:37:18,555 right. 791 00:37:18,767 --> 00:37:21,988 I would imagine other topics maybe is our final topics knowing 792 00:37:21,988 --> 00:37:25,702 what time it is. I would think labor and or technology 793 00:37:25,702 --> 00:37:28,670 would be two that are top of your members' lists if 794 00:37:28,670 --> 00:37:30,580 I were guessing. I don't know if one of those 795 00:37:30,465 --> 00:37:30,885 Yeah. 796 00:37:30,580 --> 00:37:31,000 two 797 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:35,153 is a bigger topic than the other, but I would think 798 00:37:35,210 --> 00:37:36,190 that's on everybody's 799 00:37:36,007 --> 00:37:36,367 Well. 800 00:37:36,190 --> 00:37:40,041 mind. Like labor is perennial and then technology I feel like 801 00:37:40,041 --> 00:37:42,282 has been such a pronounced 802 00:37:42,736 --> 00:37:46,703 part of the last year of like further adoption and further 803 00:37:46,703 --> 00:37:48,918 like insight as to what's possible 804 00:37:49,380 --> 00:37:51,777 and so I would think you guys would talk about both 805 00:37:51,777 --> 00:37:52,328 quite a bit. 806 00:37:53,060 --> 00:37:56,835 Sure. That's is an association and as a business. 807 00:37:57,635 --> 00:38:02,236 These are daily conversations. there's so much cool automation out 808 00:38:02,236 --> 00:38:06,009 there, you know, some of it is, you know, toys for 809 00:38:06,009 --> 00:38:06,970 the toy box, 810 00:38:07,410 --> 00:38:10,962 but some of it is being readily used. 811 00:38:11,033 --> 00:38:14,355 and the last statistic I read was 812 00:38:14,858 --> 00:38:18,658 I think it's bumping up on almost thirty percent. 813 00:38:19,303 --> 00:38:21,044 third party warehouses 814 00:38:21,806 --> 00:38:23,697 or warehouses in general 815 00:38:24,297 --> 00:38:28,559 have some type of fixed or flexible automation 816 00:38:28,819 --> 00:38:30,120 that they're currently 817 00:38:30,820 --> 00:38:32,721 using in their facility. 818 00:38:33,261 --> 00:38:33,601 And 819 00:38:33,331 --> 00:38:33,596 Okay. 820 00:38:34,521 --> 00:38:37,673 when you're thinking about in the real estate side of the 821 00:38:37,673 --> 00:38:38,323 business, 822 00:38:39,243 --> 00:38:41,704 this is likely only to grow. 823 00:38:41,824 --> 00:38:42,705 And so 824 00:38:43,225 --> 00:38:46,766 you know we still have the human component, but the 825 00:38:46,786 --> 00:38:48,027 infrastructure 826 00:38:48,529 --> 00:38:52,013 the power, for example. The data centers 827 00:38:52,433 --> 00:38:54,994 have affected the real estate business. 828 00:38:55,154 --> 00:38:59,155 It's and will continue. So once we figure out 829 00:38:59,935 --> 00:39:04,236 which areas want data centers or don't want data centers, 830 00:39:04,676 --> 00:39:08,037 if there's a data center going in, it's going to have 831 00:39:08,037 --> 00:39:12,098 a profound effect on the supporting infrastructure for those 832 00:39:12,098 --> 00:39:15,759 companies supporting the data center from 833 00:39:15,458 --> 00:39:15,730 Yeah. 834 00:39:15,780 --> 00:39:20,287 an automation standpoint. You know, hey, somebody's gotta fix the HVAC, 835 00:39:20,287 --> 00:39:24,958 somebody's gotta and there's parts that supply warehouses, et cetera, that 836 00:39:25,002 --> 00:39:25,942 will be needed 837 00:39:26,823 --> 00:39:30,664 relatively close for these people to continue to operate. 838 00:39:31,415 --> 00:39:32,895 so th on 839 00:39:33,356 --> 00:39:35,116 once that's all shaken out, 840 00:39:35,595 --> 00:39:40,237 there's some, you know, you've got high end manufacturing real 841 00:39:40,237 --> 00:39:43,027 estate that we are not a part of. 842 00:39:43,027 --> 00:39:45,568 We like to look at it and it's pretty cool. 843 00:39:46,375 --> 00:39:46,545 I 844 00:39:46,384 --> 00:39:46,762 Yeah. 845 00:39:46,545 --> 00:39:49,456 know many third party logistics folks that have 846 00:39:50,116 --> 00:39:53,397 we have some automation. I know folks that have 847 00:39:53,917 --> 00:39:58,178 end-to-end automation in certain facilities where it's 848 00:39:58,178 --> 00:39:59,719 robots, et cetera. 849 00:40:00,124 --> 00:40:04,065 the key component needed to run, regardless whether it's 850 00:40:04,766 --> 00:40:05,566 robots, 851 00:40:06,326 --> 00:40:10,747 autonomous vehicles, conveying or whatever, there's still a people 852 00:40:10,747 --> 00:40:14,920 component required at every level. And keeping 853 00:40:15,460 --> 00:40:19,201 attracting and retaining the highest and best 854 00:40:19,702 --> 00:40:23,503 is critically important to our industry. 855 00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:24,540 and 856 00:40:25,020 --> 00:40:27,401 there's not a lot of people that want to 857 00:40:28,041 --> 00:40:31,582 get into if you look at the typical eighteen year old 858 00:40:32,222 --> 00:40:35,693 career path right now, they either want to go to college, 859 00:40:35,693 --> 00:40:39,924 okay, and they're upset that AI's may replace their 860 00:40:40,457 --> 00:40:43,869 you know perceived career path. there 861 00:40:44,429 --> 00:40:46,610 or they go to a skill trade. 862 00:40:46,970 --> 00:40:50,391 And so you don't see a lot of these, you know, 863 00:40:50,451 --> 00:40:54,742 hey, when we can get a truck driver's license, maybe at 864 00:40:54,742 --> 00:40:58,385 18 they'll be more successful. But by the time you can 865 00:40:58,385 --> 00:41:00,205 get your CDL at 21, 866 00:41:01,106 --> 00:41:03,646 now you've kind of missed that gap. 867 00:41:03,866 --> 00:41:07,868 Those three years are very important as to how do we 868 00:41:07,868 --> 00:41:12,444 attract and maintain Because remember the supply chain's not just what's 869 00:41:12,444 --> 00:41:14,096 inside the four walls, you still 870 00:41:13,903 --> 00:41:14,286 Yeah. 871 00:41:14,096 --> 00:41:15,077 gotta get it there. 872 00:41:15,380 --> 00:41:15,672 Yep. 873 00:41:15,938 --> 00:41:16,838 and as 874 00:41:17,490 --> 00:41:22,118 the many issues affecting the trucking side of supply 875 00:41:22,118 --> 00:41:26,402 chain are, you know, we we've got I won't go into 876 00:41:26,402 --> 00:41:29,505 all you know between English language proficiency, 877 00:41:30,208 --> 00:41:32,339 you know, domicile drivers. 878 00:41:33,050 --> 00:41:35,938 there's been the capacity in this market 879 00:41:36,434 --> 00:41:37,334 is kind of 880 00:41:37,754 --> 00:41:38,915 going like this. 881 00:41:39,315 --> 00:41:43,616 And now we're kind of back on an upswing where capacity 882 00:41:43,616 --> 00:41:46,114 is a little bit tighter. and so 883 00:41:46,754 --> 00:41:48,375 where is it going to be next year? 884 00:41:48,375 --> 00:41:49,575 I wish I could tell you. 885 00:41:49,795 --> 00:41:53,656 The diesel prices have had a huge effect 886 00:41:54,507 --> 00:41:54,807 on 887 00:41:55,287 --> 00:41:59,968 those businesses. But when you think about the end result, you 888 00:41:59,968 --> 00:42:01,829 and I are ordering something 889 00:42:02,325 --> 00:42:05,834 Again, we're part of the thirty percent that want something in 890 00:42:05,834 --> 00:42:06,814 our doorstep 891 00:42:07,254 --> 00:42:08,035 in an hour. 892 00:42:08,380 --> 00:42:08,687 Yes. 893 00:42:08,815 --> 00:42:12,294 And in order to do that infrastructure 894 00:42:12,714 --> 00:42:15,035 really needs to be expanded 895 00:42:15,842 --> 00:42:18,783 and be there in order for that to occur. 896 00:42:19,223 --> 00:42:23,624 Unless we change our value system as a consuming public, 897 00:42:24,244 --> 00:42:26,925 and you know, I don't know if somebody's going to break 898 00:42:26,925 --> 00:42:29,999 the one hour barrier. I suspect it will happen. 899 00:42:30,501 --> 00:42:30,781 Yep. 900 00:42:31,344 --> 00:42:35,544 but quite frankly, when I first heard of the one hour 901 00:42:35,544 --> 00:42:39,417 delivery, I giggled to myself. I said, Do you really need 902 00:42:39,417 --> 00:42:42,059 it in an hour? Is it that important? 903 00:42:42,490 --> 00:42:43,410 and you look at 904 00:42:43,936 --> 00:42:47,759 what pressure that puts on every supply chain 905 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:50,902 that it's that that's trying to observe the mirror. 906 00:42:51,344 --> 00:42:53,336 and that's why the proliferation of 907 00:42:54,079 --> 00:42:55,972 of commerce warehouses 908 00:42:56,685 --> 00:42:56,945 in 909 00:42:58,167 --> 00:42:58,788 in the 910 00:42:59,469 --> 00:43:01,712 universe of commercial real estate, 911 00:43:02,112 --> 00:43:04,141 you know, what percentage is 912 00:43:04,650 --> 00:43:07,613 commerce warehouses? I know third party 913 00:43:08,294 --> 00:43:11,558 is any depending on who you ask, anywhere from twenty to 914 00:43:11,558 --> 00:43:14,192 thirty five percent of all the blocks. 915 00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:19,022 box is third party e-commerce gets mixed in sometimes with third 916 00:43:19,022 --> 00:43:20,273 party logistics. 917 00:43:20,436 --> 00:43:20,815 Yeah. 918 00:43:20,953 --> 00:43:25,177 And so that I know that sector has really 919 00:43:25,177 --> 00:43:25,977 increased 920 00:43:26,540 --> 00:43:29,192 exponentially in the last ten years. 921 00:43:29,693 --> 00:43:32,566 So and again, the only way to get it to you 922 00:43:32,566 --> 00:43:35,985 within your one hour or one day is have it much 923 00:43:35,985 --> 00:43:36,936 closer to you. 924 00:43:37,256 --> 00:43:37,566 Yes. 925 00:43:37,477 --> 00:43:40,389 And you know, we've got a lot of geography in these 926 00:43:40,389 --> 00:43:41,610 United States, so 927 00:43:42,031 --> 00:43:44,792 how convenient do you really need everything to be? 928 00:43:44,792 --> 00:43:45,803 And on one hand, 929 00:43:46,443 --> 00:43:49,535 rarely do you want less than what you're accustomed to. 930 00:43:49,535 --> 00:43:52,666 And on another, of course, there's like a practical balance. 931 00:43:53,147 --> 00:43:53,607 But 932 00:43:54,082 --> 00:43:57,444 while one hour may not be necessary for everyone, it's hard 933 00:43:57,444 --> 00:44:00,185 to imagine one day turning back into one week, 934 00:44:00,826 --> 00:44:01,416 no doubt. 935 00:44:02,152 --> 00:44:04,373 Yeah, that I totally agree. 936 00:44:05,073 --> 00:44:07,574 It's very difficult to go backwards. 937 00:44:07,989 --> 00:44:10,610 it's kind of like once there's a tax in place, 938 00:44:11,073 --> 00:44:13,554 it's pretty odd that it's gonna go away. 939 00:44:14,094 --> 00:44:14,674 So 940 00:44:14,104 --> 00:44:14,443 Yeah. 941 00:44:14,694 --> 00:44:16,455 you don't want the tax if you 942 00:44:17,355 --> 00:44:19,736 unless you're really willing to live with it. 943 00:44:19,996 --> 00:44:20,536 So 944 00:44:20,343 --> 00:44:20,853 Yeah. 945 00:44:21,633 --> 00:44:22,153 Well 946 00:44:21,857 --> 00:44:22,157 Yeah. 947 00:44:22,674 --> 00:44:24,515 I'm sensitive to your time, Doug. 948 00:44:24,515 --> 00:44:28,276 I do appreciate ya spending time with me today. 949 00:44:28,436 --> 00:44:28,816 And 950 00:44:29,365 --> 00:44:32,646 I love getting to learn more about the Acme 951 00:44:33,106 --> 00:44:37,438 like a trajectory and most importantly your story and your growth 952 00:44:37,438 --> 00:44:38,288 through it and 953 00:44:38,454 --> 00:44:38,833 Yeah. 954 00:44:38,678 --> 00:44:42,890 learning like how well you have become an example of a 955 00:44:42,890 --> 00:44:43,830 steward that's 956 00:44:44,230 --> 00:44:48,192 excited about their industry and is thinking about advocacy. 957 00:44:48,712 --> 00:44:52,427 and thinking bigger than just you and your company and I'm 958 00:44:52,427 --> 00:44:55,021 sure that's a super fulfilling to be able to serve the 959 00:44:55,021 --> 00:44:56,202 greater student body 960 00:44:56,683 --> 00:45:00,162 and then to help bring more resources and more visibility has 961 00:45:00,162 --> 00:45:02,617 got to be a pretty rewarding like venture. 962 00:45:03,382 --> 00:45:06,483 Yeah, we we're excited about what's happening. 963 00:45:06,681 --> 00:45:11,240 certainly they're at us from you know with the elections 964 00:45:11,240 --> 00:45:13,161 coming up and so forth, but 965 00:45:14,162 --> 00:45:17,483 it'll be that way forever. We we've it these are not 966 00:45:18,163 --> 00:45:18,643 new 967 00:45:19,104 --> 00:45:21,345 issues. We've been battling 968 00:45:21,865 --> 00:45:26,427 and promoting issues for the last twenty years, thirty 969 00:45:26,427 --> 00:45:26,887 years. 970 00:45:27,563 --> 00:45:30,434 we'll be doing it till the end of our lives, likely. 971 00:45:30,877 --> 00:45:31,297 so 972 00:45:31,973 --> 00:45:33,896 is as the old adage goes, 973 00:45:34,337 --> 00:45:38,104 it's better to be at the table as opposed to being 974 00:45:38,943 --> 00:45:39,157 ha. 975 00:45:39,927 --> 00:45:40,288 on the 976 00:45:40,162 --> 00:45:40,546 Yes. 977 00:45:40,288 --> 00:45:44,235 menu. And oh that's you know, it 978 00:45:44,496 --> 00:45:45,097 hey, 979 00:45:45,959 --> 00:45:48,313 I may not have been successful, but at least I gave 980 00:45:48,313 --> 00:45:50,197 it my all and we're trying, so 981 00:45:50,945 --> 00:45:53,049 Yeah. I love it. I love every minute of it. 982 00:45:53,049 --> 00:45:54,632 Thank you, Doug. I appreciate ya. 983 00:45:54,632 --> 00:45:57,717 Appreciate talking with ya and excited to learn more. 984 00:45:57,717 --> 00:45:58,654 And then I have 985 00:45:59,115 --> 00:46:01,299 as you'll see on my calendar over here, 986 00:46:01,619 --> 00:46:02,434 Thank you, Justin. 987 00:46:03,159 --> 00:46:04,239 Yeah, I have 988 00:46:04,732 --> 00:46:07,934 this year and next year's events I always plan out in 989 00:46:07,934 --> 00:46:08,494 advance. 990 00:46:09,095 --> 00:46:11,316 And I've been trying to get some of these 991 00:46:11,741 --> 00:46:15,633 events that you guys host on the calendar for next year 992 00:46:15,633 --> 00:46:17,755 'cause there's so many good ones that I feel like would 993 00:46:17,755 --> 00:46:19,766 be applicable on good learning opportunities. 994 00:46:20,478 --> 00:46:22,470 Well, I'll put in a little plug. 995 00:46:22,470 --> 00:46:26,342 Our annual convention this next year is at the end of 996 00:46:26,482 --> 00:46:29,831 April, going into May, in Puerto Rico. 997 00:46:30,512 --> 00:46:34,289 So it's it and it's gonna be an awesome 998 00:46:34,289 --> 00:46:35,399 educational 999 00:46:36,230 --> 00:46:40,212 event as well as in one of the most beautiful resorts. 1000 00:46:40,412 --> 00:46:42,593 It's called the Conquistador Resort. 1001 00:46:43,192 --> 00:46:46,964 so you know, take an extra couple days with your family 1002 00:46:47,049 --> 00:46:48,060 and make a mission. 1003 00:46:48,603 --> 00:46:50,804 and learning experience out of it, but 1004 00:46:51,371 --> 00:46:52,896 we're excited. the 1005 00:46:53,632 --> 00:46:56,853 the excitement is very high. We've got a great 1006 00:46:57,523 --> 00:47:01,474 pre registration already going on in place where you know I'm 1007 00:47:01,474 --> 00:47:05,403 sure it will sell out well in advance of the due 1008 00:47:05,403 --> 00:47:06,134 date, but 1009 00:47:06,608 --> 00:47:11,029 and as we talked earlier, real estate is a huge component 1010 00:47:11,129 --> 00:47:13,250 of why we all exist. So 1011 00:47:13,722 --> 00:47:14,026 Yeah. 1012 00:47:14,650 --> 00:47:16,353 You know, we'd love to have you there. 1013 00:47:17,595 --> 00:47:17,956 And 1014 00:47:18,717 --> 00:47:21,732 warm weather and nice blue water never hurt either. 1015 00:47:22,439 --> 00:47:24,191 You know what? it doesn't hurt. 1016 00:47:24,332 --> 00:47:26,237 That's right. All right. 1017 00:47:26,203 --> 00:47:26,647 Right on 1018 00:47:27,359 --> 00:47:28,753 Yep, thank you, Doug. Take care. 1019 00:47:28,753 --> 00:47:29,999 Talk soon. 1020 00:47:30,629 --> 00:47:31,198 Yep, bye.